ZoNation: AIG Problems

daPlumber702 Says:

Jun 5, 2010 - but nobody NOBODY has the right to have ANYTHING done for them. You do it for yourself. that is the American way after all.

jmartecep Says:

Jun 5, 2010 - I stand with what I said "Propaganda". Look, no matter how you slice we need each other, whether we pay or do for charity we use each other for survival. Now if you look at history Nazi Germany had to blame someone for their economic troubles. We are doing the same thing with the illegal immigrants now. This country has over hundreds of thousands of illegal immigrants where were grand fathered in. Should we get them out too?

jmartecep Says:

Jun 5, 2010 - Ask yourself this question. How was America formed. Everyone wasn't able to fight in the War for Independence, so does that mean that the people who couldn't fight have the right to be American? Whatever you say you need to look at the Council of Foreign Affairs because through them YOUR tax dollars goes to other Countries. So why is such a bad thing to use Tax payer dollars to make this Country Better? We are going to pay taxes, I rather see the money spent here.

daPlumber702 Says:

Jun 5, 2010 - Yes. If you are here illegally you go. Would you say that because a murderer's grandfather was a murderer, he should get away with it... because he had no control? NO! they are illegal, breaking laws, taking jobs that they have somehow convinced the public americans don't want... i ask you, who did the jobs before the mexicans? your first reaction will be to go to slaves, but you'd be pretty damned wrong. It was americans, black brown, white, orange, all colors. work is work.

daPlumber702 Says:

Jun 5, 2010 - i never argued that we didn't need each other, but that happens through the way humans are made up. Friends, family, acquaintances... We do NOT look after one another by putting it in the hands of an unseen force. what would be the sense in giving your money to un named man number one. so that she can get you the stuff you need to take care of your kid, if you could do it your damned self?

jmartecep Says:

Jun 5, 2010 - Dude, look at what you wrote. People come here illegally because there are AMERICAN COMPANIES that hire them. So who's fault is it really. I bet you if no companies hired illegal immigrants there wouldn't be any illegal immigration. We don't take a look at ourselves, that's why we have so many problems. So quick to pass blame elsewhere. If I was poor and I knew that there was a good chance another country would hire me I would test my luck too.

jmartecep Says:

Jun 5, 2010 - We let people make decisions for us. Now that we are noticing that these people are unable to what is best for the country, we cut each others throats. Why can't we just get these duds out office and put people who actually give a damn about this country in it. Companies run crazy with greed and hide be hide behind the free market. They don't care that they are helping in destroying the country. I'm not a liberal or a conservative, I am an American.

daPlumber702 Says:

Jun 5, 2010 - nobody is arguing that taxes need to be gathered/payed..what we are arguing is the extent to which the government has taken those taxes they gather. when you take it to the bare minimum of what needs... and when i say needs i mean absolutely no other choice.to be done by the government. Most of that coming in judicial, defense, and police to enforce the basic rules... assault, murder, rape, robbery etc. anything having to do with protecting one from ones self, should be thrown out

daPlumber702 Says:

Jun 5, 2010 - and why are there american companies that hire them? a multitude of reasons starting with the liberal minimum wage act. continuing on with the welfare state and ending up with the fact that Mexico is a complete hell hole. what you fail to realize is that with a welfare state like we have, to allow these people in, and give them citizenship is like the government taking a blank check from each legal american and handing it to an illegal one. where is that right?

daPlumber702 Says:

Jun 5, 2010 - you're talking about greed like it's a bad thing.. yet i quote you "If I was poor and I knew that there was a good chance another country would hire me I would test my luck too. " Greed runs the world... for the good, whether or not you want to see it. What's wrong is that those people you want to replace have made it harder to gain from greed, which in turn screws the american people. when a business can't make money neither can we. till people figure that out we're stuck.

jmartecep Says:

Jun 5, 2010 - I have no problem with the minimum wage act. I don't think Americans should be exploited for their labor in order to make a small number of individuals rich. I agree with you about the welfare state, it breads dependency on the government. I say that college should be free and once you completed your educational path you should be on your own. The bottom line is we need money to survive. If no one is hiring then what is the other course of action?

daPlumber702 Says:

Jun 5, 2010 - ..."should be thrown out", and once you get it to that bare minimum, what you are relying on is your fellow man woman and child to do the right thing. will it happen every time? No, probably not. but it isn't perfect now either, and instead of making our own choices they are taken away from us. Also, that system relies on people like you and me to be mindful and take care of our fellow americans... humans. The american spirit we know now has held firm for almost 200 years...

jmartecep Says:

Jun 5, 2010 - Your right, greed does run the world and what we are going through now is the product of greed. America was formed from radical thinking. Freedom has went through many stages. Technology has minimized the working space greatly. However, our thinking hasn't caught up with it yet. We have to rethink how we are living now, because if we don't, we really will be stuck.

daPlumber702 Says:

Jun 5, 2010 - not thanks to the spreading of wealth but IN SPITE of it. A true capitalist society without the influences of those that want to spread the wealth would prosper and in doing so would raise not only the level of it's wealthy but of it's poor. History has proven this true again and again.

jmartecep Says:

Jun 5, 2010 - Listen, we have always had wealth distribution, that's what taxes are. What shifted is that the middle class and lower class pay more. Why is that? Look up the 16th Amendment, which wasn't ratified, and you'll see that it is illegal. Pear Harbor is a perfect example of your fellow man picking up the slack of others with pride. It should take a tragedy for us to get together and fix this country.

jmartecep Says:

Jun 5, 2010 - sure thing. Look up taxes and the history of taxes and tell me what it is. Your tax dollars go to the Federal Reserve which our government borrows from. The FED is led by a centralized banking system which is not government ran. So your money is making a small group of individuals rich, Wealth distribution. Look it up when you get a chance. You have a great evening.

daPlumber702 Says:

Jun 5, 2010 - and there in lies your problem. You must be one of those guys that thinks a corporation is an endless pit of wealth and resources. Before the minimum wage was instituted wages across the board had begun to rise, not as fast as people wanted them, but like i said, greed. free college? smart, start people's adult lives off with that same entitlement feeling they had as children. No make people pay for their college education.

daPlumber702 Says:

Jun 5, 2010 - let me ask you, this "free" college you're talking about... are you going to force the janitors and teachers and deans to work for no wage? are you going to kick people out of their buildings, houses, schools to have somewhere to teach the classes in this "free" College system? are we supposed to force the water, power, book, desk, chalk companies to give over their services without being made whole? Nothing NOTHING is free. when you learn that you'll learn the way things work.

Aegius Says:

Aug 18, 2010 - Actually the Fed is gov-ran. It's a gov institution. Still central banking is a terrible idea. We should hand banking over the states as was done from 1836 to 1914.

Kelebummer Says:

Apr 30, 2011 - As a European, I find it odd that Americans use the term "liberal" to describe someone who advocates government expansion into business. Liberals advocate free trade, freedom to own private property and freedom of religion (ie liberty). These aren't inherently statist values.To me at least, it would seem that liberalism is an ideology more instep with American constituional values than the conservative christian rhetoric expoused by the hard right.

wasabimanic Says:

May 26, 2011 - Yep, seems the Left sorely need to do likewise,then there'd be more mature reasoned debate. Just seems baiting the "other camp" satisfies something dark and unsavoury in many folks minds. Rising above that requires true class, That's ZO for YO.

jayvthompson01 Says:

Oct 2, 2011 - GATOR WANTS HIS GAT BITCH!!!!!

The1deemann Says:

Nov 7, 2011 - AMEN !

The1deemann Says:

Nov 7, 2011 - .....TRUTH !

The1deemann Says:

Nov 7, 2011 - I will if you are not willing...lol....RIGHT on  !